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Polish-English Translation Forum

This is the place to post your translation requests in English or Polish and to help others with your skills and knowledge. Important: Always give the context of your enquiry!
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OED and English spelling » answer
by Catesse (AU), Last modified: 2010-05-15, 06:59  Spam?  
Some of you may be well ahead of me, but I have only just found this site.
Wikipedia(EN): Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style_(spelling)
It lists common spelling variants for words, and shows that the standard advocated by the Oxford English Dictionary is often NOT the standard adopted by The Times, The Financial Times, The Guardian and the BBC publications. In other words, the major British media and publishers reject the OED as being too American and not current best practice.
Food for thought.
This was meant to go into the EN-DE forum, but I got lost, so I'll leave it here as well.
My experience of school in Britain  #520305
by Windfall (GB), 2010-05-24, 15:23  Spam?  
is that I got taught the variants commonly used in the newspapers rather than the variant in the OED. Finding what the OED considered the main spelling occasionally came as rather a shock as a consequence.
19th Century "é" = 20th Century "y" and/or "e" ? » answer
by dfoote (US), Last modified: 2010-04-22, 21:48  Spam?  
DUCAS PRUSSIAE AN. 1566-1568. :
Przedstawienia stanów nie odniosły spodziewanego skutku. Albrecht dal im ostrą odprawę. Pobór jednak uchwalono. W kilka lat późniéj stany, dbając o czystość wyznania według formuły augsburskiéj, znów śmieléj wystąpiły do księcia z prośbą o przywrócenie dawnéj ustawy kościelnéj. Było to w końcu r. 1562. Zatarg między Albrechtem a stanami z powodu spraw kościelnych jątrzéć się poczynał.  

But Microsoft Word spell-check, GoogleTranslate, and dictionaries can't interpret the "é". Does it change any of the meaning if I change all of the "é" to "y" or "e"?

é should be e in this text.  #514125
by Windfall (GB), Last modified: 2010-04-26, 13:35  Spam?  
except in  jątrzéć, which I think should jątrzyć
? » answer
anonymous, 2010-03-05, 19:10  Spam?  89.104.1....
Comparative/Superlative for adjective inflections » answer
by admin (AT), 2010-02-24, 15:22  Spam?  
Hi people!

I was going through Polish inflections this morning and wasn't quite sure on how we should treat comparatives of adjectives like optymistyczny? Apparently, the form optymisticznejszy does exist but, according to one native expert I spoke to this morning, is almost never used (and gives way to bardziej optymisticzny.)

The same applies for cudowny vs. cudownejszy, for example, or okropny vs. - I guess - okropnejszy (I couldn't find a single Google result that actually used the word.) How would you go about handling these forms?

My proposal is that we use the "|| - | -" only to indicate that there are no comparative and superlative forms, and in other cases just list the four positive forms and then, if there is any actual use thereof which could be interesting to the average dictionary user, the -szy comparative and superlaive. If not, than not. (I wouldn't list the "bardziej" + positive forms in the inflections bar, as they can be easily looked up by looking up the meaning of bardziej and of the adjective in the positive.)

Are you fine with this? All suggestions welcome.

That sounds about right to me.  #499335
by Windfall (GB), 2010-02-24, 18:24  Spam?  
It's not completely ideal for people trying to learn Polish, but the inflections bar is actually too small to cope with the issues of Polish inflections anyhow, so this is no worse than what happens with nouns.
wpięcie » answer
by Windfall (GB), 2010-02-18, 12:11  Spam?  
Does anyone know what wpięcie means? I found it in the sentence:

Powszechne stają się kamery umożliwiające bezpośrednie wpięcie w sieć Grupy.

Cameras have become widespread, allowing direct ??? in(to?) the Group's network.
wpięcie  #497609
by mieczj, 2010-02-20, 09:58  Spam?  83.8.61....
"wpięcie" is noun from verb "stick", probably also "stick"(?)
Thank you  #497673
by Windfall (GB), 2010-02-20, 15:25  Spam?  
connection  #498696
by, 2010-02-23, 12:06  Spam?  94.127.109....
You can not stick a camera into a networt, you can just connect it to the network.
That was what I'd hoped.  #498703
by Windfall (GB), 2010-02-23, 12:16  Spam?  
I did it as connection. Ta for that.
Words that have two word classes in one language only » answer
by Windfall (GB), 2009-11-27, 14:15  Spam?  
What do we do if a word has two word classes in one language, but only one in the other? For instance od - since. You can use since as either a conjunction or a preposition, but to my knowledge (and assuming I have understood Word Reference correctly) , od can only be used as a preposition. As there is no option to label one side of the entry with one word class and the other with another, what do we do? Should we label the entry od - since [prep.] [conj.], or should we label it just [prep.]?

To add to the confusion, word reference does translate the conjunction since with the preposition od, however the example it gives to do this, in my view uses the "since" as a preposition, not a conjunction. Using Google translate, I'd guess that the correct translation of since as a conjunction is od kiedy, so, assuming this is correct,should the entries in fact be:

od [prep]  since
od kiedy [conj.] since

Word classes  #478995
by muhamed (BA/AT), 2009-11-27, 15:41  Spam?  
Hi Laura!

My view on this is that the word class field should simply include all possible word classes that a word can have in the meaning to which the translation pair refers to. We should simply list all the correct word classes in the word class field separated by a single space (examples: conj prep, adj past-p, etc.). If one of the word classes can be inflected, than it should be listed first (as this helps the inflections function).

There seems to be a lot of confusion on conjunctions versus prepositions versus adverbs depending on where you look and whom you ask, and IMHO this isn't such an important issue. (On this note: distinguishing word classes really does matter - as in, well, all other dictionaries - when, for example, you take the English word beat. beat {verb} is Polish bić; beat {noun}...
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Hmmm  #478998
by Windfall (GB), Last modified: 2009-11-27, 15:57  Spam?  
I'm not sure I understand what you want. Just to check, although beat can be a noun and a verb in English, you wouldn't want the entry:
beat [noun] [verb] bić
or alternatively the entry
since [conj] [prep] seitdem
(seitdem being a conjunction, but not a preposition, but since being usable as either).

Or is this precisely what you want? I'm not clear from your answer.

There is only one place I have been able to find od listed aas a conjunction, and that's in the Google Translate dictionary:

but here it means than. So, although since and od can potentially both be used as conjunctions, as conjunctions they are not translations of each other (assuming Google Translate is correct on this). I will try and check this out with some native speakers.
by muhamed (BA/AT), 2009-11-27, 17:03  Spam?  
Yes, that kind of is what I would want to say, but I'm afraid this may become a long and rather boring answer if I explain in detail - sorry for making it such a sausage.

"Beat" as a noun cannot mean "bić" in Polish, so that the first entry you propose is exactly what we shouldn't have in the dictionary. But taking German and English as an example, "seit" and "since" can both be a conjunction and a preposition in the same meaning - which is why their word class is simply entered as prep conj.  Same goes, for example, for word pairs where the adjective and adverb forms are the same (then adj adv), and so on. That's kinda what I wanted to say - having two word classes listed, if they're both corrected, is completely OK.

On a more complicated note: if "od" can be used as a preposition there where the...
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Thanks,  #479016
by Windfall (GB), 2009-11-27, 17:10  Spam?  
I think I understand.

I too like Google Translate. Despite its many flaws, it's the best automatic translator out there that I know of and a handy tool if you add it to some existing language knowledge.
Problems  #479088
by Catesse (AU), 2009-11-28, 04:52  Spam?  
Nie miała baba kłopotu, kupiła się prosię. (Or something like that.)
Laura, I'm lost after the first two or three sentences.
I asked Agnieszka  #479094
by Windfall (GB), 2009-11-28, 11:23  Spam?  
who looked it up. Od is defintely just a preposition. I think that therefore the appropriate entry is
since [prep] od.
Since as a temporal conjunction (e.g. since I moved house...) is going to need another entry.
Here's an interesting one  #479098
by Windfall (GB), 2009-11-28, 12:10  Spam?  
word reference agrees that od can be used as a conjunction, but it doesn't mean since, it really does mean than:

so definitely putting conj in the since - od entry would be confusing and likely to lead to wrong assumptions.
Progress Report » answer
by Catesse (AU), 2009-11-25, 07:58  Spam?  
I have been promising for a week or two – ever since we reached the 3 000 verified votes mark - to put a “state of the nation” letter on the EN-PL forum, but I was working too hard to concentrate on it.
First, I should like to say that I had no authority to tell people what to do with their entries and votes. However, I could see that there was going to be dreadful trouble ahead if the number of entries was allowed to increase at too fast a rate before the contributors had managed to build up enough voting power to verify votes almost as quickly as they were made. Since I had no authority, I should like to thank our small group of contributors for their splendid voluntary cooperation, which has had the result that the EN-PL site is the only one where the English site is on a higher percentage rating that the...
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Thanks, Catesse!  #478997
by Paul (AT), Last modified: 2009-11-27, 15:47  Spam?  
Pronouns » answer
by Windfall (GB), 2009-11-24, 14:35  Spam?  
With pronouns that aren't in the nominative (like "me" in English or "go" or "mnie" in Polish), are we supposed to be entering these all individually in or will the inflections bar handle this? If we are supposed to be entering them separately, can I propose we adopt one of the following 2 format options:

go [acc.] [gen.]  him
or, entering them separately as:
go [acc.]  him
go [gen.]  him

Without the case data, I think the Polish side would be entirely useless to non-native speakers. Maybe we also need extra data on the English side. For instance him [direct or indirect object], although I think the English side might be less confusing without.

I suggest that we don't mark nominatives at all (unless a pronoun covers a nominative and another case), as it can be assumed that individual nouns in the dictionary are in the nominative unless part of a phrase or unless specified otherwise.
pronouns  #477979
by muhamed (BA/AT), 2009-11-24, 14:56  Spam?  
Hi Laura!

We should indeed create entries for pronoun forms outside of the nominative case, as it is beyond the scope of the inflections bar to handle the whole variety of grammatically possible forms.

I believe that your first suggestion - with an indication of all Polish cases to which the form corresponds on the Polish side and no additional information on the English side; apart from the major potential for confusion which you're right about, the indication of the case on the Polish side is in itself the most important practical and useful information for people learning the language.
Thanks  #477987
by Windfall (GB), 2009-11-24, 15:02  Spam?  
Plurals » answer
by Windfall (GB), 2009-10-16, 14:48  Spam?  
(Comment made below before I was able to access to CONTR. category)

I've seen a few Polish plurals tagged [plurale tantum], i.e. noun that only exists in the plural. Are we using this tag?

Also, these words tend to have been marked {m. pl.} to indicate the underlying tense (which is important to know when using the word). I agree that this information ought to be presented, but I would like to know if this is the preferred form for doing so before I vote in favour of these entries.
Laura: new tags  #468719
by muhamed (BA/AT), 2009-10-16, 14:59  Spam?  
Please do note that, after a series of discussions in various new languages and with some of the Polish contributors, we have new added plural tags for each of the genders - you can find these in the guideline section. Entries tagged {m}{pl} or merely {pl} should therefore be updated.

The [plurale tantum] is, just like the [dual], a manually entered tag, which can be used, but has to be entered manually. AFAIK the technical Polish term for plurale tantum is - surprise surprise - plurale tantum, and it includes some words you wouldn't expect to include (say, Helsinki - which is weirdly plural in Polish), so I'm personally in favor of using the tag :)
Ta  #468720
by Windfall (GB), 2009-10-16, 15:05  Spam?  
Oh yes, just spotted {} etc. Useful. (If only Polish adopted German's nice simple approach to the plural - honestly, until I learnt Polish, I never thought I'd find myself describing German grammar as simple).
CONTR. Polish Plurals » answer
by Windfall (GB), 2009-10-16, 14:28  Spam?  
4;Paul, my drop down menu for forum category doesn't have a CONTR for Polish, so I'm having to use CHAT.

Back on plurals:

I've seen a few Polish plurals tagged [plurale tantum], i.e. noun that only exists in the plural. Are we using this tag?

Also, these words tend to have been marked {m. pl.} to indicate the underlying tense (which is important to know when using the word). I agree that this information ought to be presented, but I would like to know if this is the preferred form for doing so before I vote in favour of these entries.
Laura: It should have one as soon as you've submitted 10 votes.  #468716
by Paul (AT), 2009-10-16, 14:39  Spam?  
It might help to reload the page.
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